Episode · 1 month ago

Don’t Build on Rented Land with Guest Shane Shaps


On this episode of the NerdBrand podcast, we have Shane Shaps as our guest. Shane is the President, Founder, and Community Manager of 520 East Brands, a social media engagement firm.

This show focuses on Facebook's recent downtime and why it can be problematic to build your brand presence on “rented land." Other things we discuss are related to ad fatigue and how to keep your digital ads engaging. 

We also comment on a couple of things Google just updated. Hint: watch those title tags!

And then you know kind of give you kindof the floor for a bit. I forgot to put that in the nose, but yeah we usuallytry to give our guest like a little bit to tell who they are, what they do,what they like you know. What's the name of your dog or cat, you know it'sup to you. This may go into the this may go into the cold open on her brand podcast. Everybody in yourhouse Jason. That's John, and this is shame Shans from five twenty eastbrands, and today we're going to be talking about being real and socialmedia and using your voice and branding. But for right now, shame I'm going togive you the floor to kind of tell a people who you are, what you do, whatyou love that kind of thing sure so who I am I'm Shane Shack. I am a nativeLouisvillian who left for a long time came back in two thousand and two andin two thousand and eight I started this business. Basically, because Isaid my cousin won somebody just pay me to play on facebook and she's good yeah,so I started this agency, and so we are an outsource voice for the brands werepresent. We work with a lot of companies who either don't have time,don't have the know how or just don't want to deal with it, but they knowthat they have to have a social media presence, but a lot of times. Whatthey'll do is just set up a facebook page and then they post on it for likethree weeks straight they've, all this great stuff and then a year later,they're like Oh, we never did anything and consistency is obviously key. So wewill basically take over their social presence for them and come up with astrategy of persona and deliver on different social media platforms thatmakes sense for their brand their audience and their budget to produceand grow a community. So we're not just about creating fans that, like yourfacebook, page we're really about engaging with people and building acommunity for raving fans around your brand and then- and you know whathappened earlier- this week happens and...'re like I. I can't work today,facebooks down yeah. No, it's like we've been saying since two thousandand sixteen don't put all your eggs in one basket. You know, but a Joe Pelets who's like godfather ofcontent marketing. You know he says, don't build on rented land and that'sexactly what that is. Building on rent to land. Facebook owns your content,which means, if you don't have somewhere else, they own your business. You know it's like that. The doors werelocked you couldn't get in, so don't build on rented land own yourstuff, eas much as possible. You know, I think I saw that recent post for meafter the face fook thing- and I mean just about everything's rentedunfortunately today, but you have more control over some things than others.But but you know we thought we had. Control of our email lists come to findout apple and Google seem to his control of it. Actually in your inboxand actually being able to use it. You know super the marketing channels. It'slike who knows what what's going to happen. I've always had the the verywild theory that eventually google will just be websites. You know it's justinside Google, you will have your websites, there will be no externalwebsites, but I know this pro stanger brain. I never thought about that. YeahI mean Google, so look at like Google origins and when it started out, I meanhe's a portal like yeah. You know that that was the Internet and then youwould like put something in there or click a link, and then it was just like you would stumble across. Maybe whatyou were looking for. You know that no I'm talking like Nid de late nines typeInternet, and then you know when you got into search. That was a differentanimal. That was a new way of thinking and they were there for that and how tomake money on that. That was the trick like right. Now there are more searchads at the top of the search engine page than her have been before I comeof annoying and that's been happening. I that's a new roll out that I knowit's still slowly, slowly, propagating...

...across the Internet. Also Lars I'm singing the dreadedlisting websites come back and listing. I don't know how these are still around. A search is literally a listing face,depart right. Director sites are they're,brutal and every category high red I mean we see it with. Even if you do amarketing agency, it's just like clutch up city, local city, whatever may yeyeah yeah, you have to pay to be on there. So right, you know it wouldn't.Surprise me, John to your theory. I wis it just my thing is: is like now you'regoing to end up paying to be on the first page. It's not something! There'sthe word. Organic has had this connotation of free and it's not right.It's not yeah. So I think that that's about to come true that it's not it'sgoing to be paid to be there. You want to be there, that's what it is, so thewhole page is an ant because we always say in our organization. Everything isan ad. Well, it's transforming that way, because how d advertising is nowlimited to reach the specific audiences because of IOS fifteen or whatever, right yeah you're going to have tofigure out how to do advertising differently every single social mediapost. I can imagine the talk a little bit about like what howmuch time on average does it take to just, let's T, no matter of the network,just to figure out what you're trying to put in that post the text, the copyfor the post, not the imagery or anything else, because I have hadmoments where I have had like the art work and I'm like what do I say andthen I have to well. It always ties back to your objectives. What are youtrying to do? Where are you trying to leave people you know for us? Were weare a mechanism for getting web traffic, so we want to be putting things outthere that are engaging the God people to engage on the post directly, butit's got to be peeking their interest into what we do as a breadman and thendepending on which platform more on.

What's the ejective, what is theobjective of the company? What is the objective of our team and how are weleading people back there? So for one one client, I work with it's very clear.It's very specific. Their objective is foot traffic and lead forms, so we canmeasure all of that and tie effect what we're doing if you're not measuring it.You don't really know if what you're doing is working so measurement isreally important, and I think where I have the biggest challenge where it I'mpretty quick on discover an undeciding copy for social media post in general.But when it comes to advertising the facebook advent manager is the bane ofmy existence. I can't stand it and I I have to deal with it. I really it'slike the worst platform ever created yeah. My team will tell you they'll, belike shame. We have to run an ad for so, and so I'm like Oh they'll, take melike five hours. I mean it does in to take fifteen minutes, but it's reallyfrustrating but coming up with the right copy and putting the right copyin the right place on that ad to entice people to click, make sure even withthe imagery you know, we'll have an ad that'll run for a while and it'll saycreative fatigue, which just like stop using this picture, nobody's looking atthis anymore, and you know I've had that happen where I say to the client.I cannot run this at any more until you give me a new picture, can't do it sothe advertising piece of it is really challenging, and you know you want tomake sure you've got just characters and no doubt that to you don't wantpeople to have to click through the bread, the rest of it. So I find thatto be the biggest challenge as far as copy writing Yahoo. Le Search is that, like I wasn'tgoing to bring it up, but I mean they're rewriting title tags in thesearch engine very aggressive right now. So if your title tag is written as anad, not as the topic of the page you're, probably seeing huge drops and resultsright now, yeah, that's interesting yeah, so you have to yeah. We don'ttalk so much at ner brand because but it keeps coming up- and I know we'regoing to have to deal with it in some way we bout it or something becausepeople just don't understand how much...

...time it takes to do it, and it's almostlike a separate service line apart from marketing and web and branding it's notintegrating and you can't it can't just be anybody. It's got to be somebody whoknows what the drink, even Google ads I'll deal with facebook ad manager. Ihate it, but I can do it. Google, AD manager, you need somebody, you knew aspecialist you could blow through those hundred dollar. Remember those littlehundred La free gift guards he got. I love there in like thirty seconds, withno results. So I don't use- I don't do that anymore. I unsourced that to it averified on those paid ones, you can do tag modifiers, that's where you seelike twenty five percent off Blah Blah Blah. Those are useful for search hands,not display but yeah, but when you have like your organic results, if you popin there the best whatever ye might work as long as that's a part of thecontent and part of the topic of the page. But if that's just your angle, toget ranked no google right, Google is now rewriting that, and so yeah copy is something that that'sthe biggest part of our jobs and what we do is trying to figure out how tosay things the right way, but go back to like we're talking about brand voice.I mean and being authentic. It's like we're not going to like shove words inyour mouth as a branding agency. When we sit and talk you we're just were'rereally actively listening and I've done that before with a lot of folks andJohn has and so is mich where they end up spilling what their passion is. Whattheir actual messages and then we go on to the madium and platforms that youmanage, and the websites and all this other stuff and we're like that is noton there anywhere it's not on there. So yeah we have a broken message. You know,would you like? Let us show you what that would looklike right for people to kind of get their head around that because theydon't. I don't know, that's not a SOT, a widget they're being sold. I didn'tsell them tires for their car. You know I'm Soling, I'm selling them thepossibility, I'm selling them, like maybe air. Out of this thing I don'tknow, there's not a a good analogy for..., so I'll just leave it at that.Shang talk a little bit about your else, not to give away your trade secrets oranything. But I know I mean we're kind of talking about the operational sideof social media and time management actually getting stuff out the doorthat works. You go have a writing process. I mean we talk about acontent calendar things like that. That may be a small business owner is notyou know, neck deep and marketing, and the twitter verse doesn't hear theseterms that often yeah sure. So we have a couple of systems that we use withsome plants. It's really as it's easy as Google sheets, where we've just got.You know date, piece of content, link, graphic heracles and we'll schedulethat out we use base camp for project management.It's simple! It's easy! It's cost effective! So for my internal team, wedo that and then some of our clients are actually on their projects as wellOn base camp, so we can communicate back and forth with them and that justhelps to keep us organized. I would say if you're a small business- and youwant to do your own social media- and you don't know you know you sit downyou like. I don't know what post well take Alon at the calendar. What kind ofbusiness do you have and what about it is seasonal. So then, you can literallydo this on a piece of paper month by month. What's important to yourbusiness that month, do you have a school supply. Company well August isgoing to be a pretty big month for you. So let's talk about that and then youknow, may you're going to be celebrating the end of the school yearand maybe you're doing a book by back. You know whatever it may be, maybethey're doing a donation and giving back to the community of all thosecolored pencils that never got used. So I think that you have to look at yourown business. I don't think that there is sort of a rule book that says inJanuary you post about this. I think it really depends on your business, yourvoice, your brand and what is important to your brand at different points ofthe year. You can go more specifically. I recommend, starting with that monthby month and then about three weeks into the month. Look at the next month.What's coming, what do we need to talk...

...about? Do we have any specials? Are wegoing to a conference? Are we speaking? Do we have a special guest coming in what is going on next month? Thatreally has to do with our business, and it really can be that simple. The otherthing you can do- and I know this sounds silly, but we do do it for atleast one client. We Google silly holidays, because we can tie this this particular productinto anything and we'll be like it's, this celebrities birthday- or this wasthe day the Blah Blah Blah happened in history. So take a look at that becauseyou know maybe it's been twenty four hours and you haven't posted anythingand you feel like you need to get back in front of your audience. Maybethere's some kind of you know today is chocolate day and we're an ice creamstore far. I don't know I I not posted about this, so so yeah take a look atsome of those. Certainly don't make all of your messaging about silly holidays,but a few times a month perfectly reasonable and it's an easy way,especially for a small business to internally make their branding theirtheir marketing schedule Tin to the brand. I would love for us to be ableto expand on some of that, because we only have like two that for me that Ilike May. The fourth sometimes made the fifth, because you know right thisfifth yeah but anyhow, but the other ones coming up and that's Halloween andwe're doing our night is going to be Nerto win and that's good and well.Nerto wing is not a nerd brand cain term yeah, it's just not actually justa thing in culture in our culture, so it's like, but for us on our podcast.You know I mean we. I like Halloween, there's a lot of people that are likeand I'm like. I don't know why it's a lot of fun. I mean look, how many, howmuch revenues generated out of it? It's almost as much as it's getting to bealmost as much as the holidays. I guess I mean John. That's that's one reallymore in your court, but I just look at all the investment and all the moneyflowing around just from candy and...

...decorations and everything I mean. Ifwe had an office, then yeah it be decorated. I mean I used to know a guy.He was in HR and this is years and years ago he had y'all. Remember theCRIP keeper Yeah Grip. He had him and he would put him up in the main officewhen people would come in and it was an engineering place so when they wouldwalk in just raise its head and laugh a horrible. I mean a well here's thequestion around Halloween Candy Cornder, no candy cort. Where do you stand little bit a little? I think yeah. I would agreewith John a little bit. I mean it's sort of like become a part of the brandof Halloween. In the view of that, if you don't forme it is Halloween. We allow ourselves to get one bag with the pumpkins on theinside and my husband and I fight over them and we literally eat them tillwe're sick and then that's it see an next erole. What about the caramelsthat are wrapped in the black and orange like ran? You remember thoseyeah like nobody ever touched. Those if you put those out that was all that wasleft because nobody wanted that it was so. I as well put an apple in my bag.For Goodness Sakes Yeah. It was sort of like like the fun size, candy bars andthen all that's left in the bag is milky ways. I mean nobody wants them.You know we we at least know work. Okay, I don't like a Onota big fan of coconut, but if you bring a twix in this housethere min yeah, yeah so yeah so yeah Halloween is likethat yeah we're going to do the the Nerto wing and have some have some funbut yeah. It's sort of the it's a holiday that I've always that I likedjust because what it does with people in Samely, morth and Christmas.Christmas almost brings out the worst, at least at least on Black Friday,which is coming up, and if you're planning that now to say that you're on your back foot isunder statement a shame. Well, thank... for being on the show we've had, I hope, like I hope everybody out therewas able to take something away from this. If you're listening you're, likeyou know what I really need to next year up my game on social media, we'dlove to talk with you, you actually now know who one of our preferred vendorsare to help us out and help you out is now. So we would love to to have thatconversation John, you got anything you want to pluganything for just finally close, not us, but definitely a shame if you want tokind of tell people where they can find you or your website and obviously onsocial sure. So you can find me at five. Twenty East brandom people want to knowwhere that name came from. I used to live in New York City at Five D. Twenty,seventy Second Street, I twenty a yeah, that's what it is by twenty prancome iswhere you can find us. You can find me on twitter at five twenty e brand. Iwill always treat you back and Monday's at noon. You can find me live onfacebook, Lington and Youtube for my left. Get real show and Jason was arecent guest. So if you missed it, you can catch up on Youtube. there. You Go,there's all the deeds peoples so as you're here on Youtube. Listening to usmake sure you, like him, subscribe hit the bell get the latest videos. We wantto thank our recent subscribers. We've had two or three of you. Thanks to youfor thanks to you, you can tell it's Friday and I'm hungry, because this iswhere I start to break down. This is like a thing in the show. I swear to goguys, evrybody out there. Listening to this, it is the amick Jason really isthis goofy anyway do have an almond joy. I know I don'tlike Cocina either so anyways you can find us at ner brandagency everywhere on social media. You can also find us at ner brand agencyCOM podcast to listen to this latest episode or watch the video of it. Wewant to thank all of our listeners and...

...subscribers once again. Thank you.Shame for being on the show and to everybody out there remember, keepingnerd brand strong t.

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